BONUS: Faith, Feminism, and the American South

Host: 00:00:17

Hello and welcome to this special bonus episode following on from the latest episode of America History.

Host: 00:00:23

We recently published the episode what is the Bible Belt?

Host: 00:00:26

Which you can listen to right now.

Host: 00:00:28

And I'm delighted to be joined by Megan Hunt, who was our guest on the episode, who's stuck around, and to discuss this a little bit more.

Host: 00:00:36

Megan, thank you for joining me again.

Megan Hunt: 00:00:38

Yeah, no problem.

Megan Hunt: 00:00:39

Happy to continue the conversations.

Host: 00:00:42

Yeah, really loved doing this episode.

Host: 00:00:45

And, you know, I, I do wonder why it's taken me so long to, to address this for the first time, but it's an important topic.

Host: 00:00:51

Religion just feels like such a.

Host: 00:00:53

A central part of American life.

Host: 00:00:56

And even though it's.

Host: 00:00:57

I feel like we're, we're supposed to be a Catholic country, and yet religion isn't half as important to us in the UK as it feels like it is to Americans in the U.S.

Host: 00:01:08

yeah.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:09

I mean, I think there's, there's lots to sort of unpick there, as you said.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:14

You know, on the one hand, we have a more formal relationship between the church and state, obviously, than the US that ostensibly doesn't have that.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:23

But the way that that then plays out in reality is profoundly different.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:28

I mean, I think there's lots of things that we don't really have the time to fully engage with today, but I think, you know, there's, there's the reality of a lot of sort of people who first traveled to North America were doing so because of religious beliefs.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:44

You know, there's lots of groups that were historically persecuted in Europe who were then particularly attracted by the idea of, you know, the New World and inverted commas.

Megan Hunt: 00:01:54

So I guess there's some level of sort of religious identity baked in and maybe a particularly sort of outsider idea of your religion as being really important to you, but also part of the reason why you maybe don't belong anywhere else, you know, that that's worth thinking about.

Megan Hunt: 00:02:11

And then I guess the other thing I would just briefly mention is, you know, some of the overt religiosity that we see in American culture today is a relatively recent phenomenon, often associated with the early Cold War, that, you know, a lot of, a lot of Americans began to assert religion in a way that they maybe hadn't done in previous generations because of its sort of presumed distinction from the Soviet Union.

Megan Hunt: 00:02:41

es, for example, is a sort of: 1950

Megan Hunt: 00:02:51

So there are, I think, lots.

Megan Hunt: 00:02:53

I mean, there's.

Megan Hunt: 00:02:54

And there's infinite Things that I haven't mentioned there, but I think there's so many examples of particular, particular historical events or particular developments in American history that are really crucial to this story that do make for a distinct environment when it comes to religion.

Host: 00:03:11

Yeah, absolutely.

Host: 00:03:12

We talked a bit on the main podcast about, you know, the sort of stereotypes, particularly, you know, how, you know, mass media and Hollywood kind of perpetuate these sort of stereotypes of religion and the Bible Bell.

Host: 00:03:24

And all the time we were talking, the one film that stuck in my head was Blind the Blind side with Sandra Bullock.

Host: 00:03:30

And we talked because we spoke a lot about, you know, how that sort of difference perhaps between, you know, white religion and black religion and you know, how maybe that's presented in slightly different ways, but with.

Host: 00:03:44

There was one sort of stereotype we didn't touch on, which was this idea of like the religious middle class housewife, which is a really common character in Hollywood.

Host: 00:03:53

And I think for a long time was pretty much the only role that older women in Hollywood could probably get.

Host: 00:03:57

Right?

Megan Hunt: 00:03:58

Yeah, yeah, definitely.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:00

Yeah.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:01

I mean, that's a definite characterization that's worth thinking about.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:05

And you know, again, it sort of has roots in other Southern stereotypes.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:09

So we talked on the original episode about Southern hospitality, which, you know, and the ways in which that's then in conflict with a lot of Southern history.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:18

You know, the idea that it's a welcoming place place is not borne out by history, obviously.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:23

But women, you know, particularly white women, have, you know, did have traditions in the south of developing various sort of, you know, ideas of philanthropy, of sort of joining various clubs to commemorate the Confederacy, for example.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:39

So there's a long history of white Southern women asserting themselves quite politically, but through these sort of tradition, more traditional, gender defined ways of doing that.

Megan Hunt: 00:04:51

And so the idea that a middle to upper class white Southern woman would be very involved in her community, would be very involved in all sorts of sort of charitable organizations, etc.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:03

Is a very sort of long standing phenomenon.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:06

It's not necessarily a uniquely Southern thing.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:09

There's lots of historians who've written about women's societies and women's clubs across the country, but I think there is definitely an assumed conservatism about a lot of this work in the south, particularly, you know, the idea that many women's clubs in the south were not invested in the suffrage movement.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:29

They were often actively opposed to it.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:32

Many of them practiced segregation in their organizations, which again, put them sometimes at odds with more kind of national, you know, versions of these big organizations, etc.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:45

So, yeah, it is a kind of stereotype, and there is, I think, a kind of performed femininity often associated with the south as well, that often plays out in cinema in all sorts of ways.

Megan Hunt: 00:05:59

I mean, another obvious example I'm sure many people will have seen is the Help, you know, again, which very much sort of presents a lot of issues in the south, but through this lens of kind of society, women, which I think is really interesting.

Host: 00:06:15

And I'm really interested because you've given us so much insight on the podcast about all of this and clearly spent many years researching all of this.

Host: 00:06:28

And I just wonder where your fascination started with the American South.

Megan Hunt: 00:06:35

Yeah, that's a good question.

Megan Hunt: 00:06:38

I mean, I think probably some of it came from a wider interest in the US And I studied American Studies originally, and I guess there is, I think, an assumption that actually a lot of our ideas of a very pronounced American identity that we might have in Britain or in Europe play out more in the South.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:00

So often when we think about quintessentially American things, they are often actually quite Southern.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:08

And so I guess I've always been interested in that projection because I think it plays out particularly prominently on the international stage, where, you know, if your main engagement with the United States for a long time is through the media, then how that actually sort of manipulates and creates the images that you have.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:29

So I guess I always had that sort of understanding or, you know, expectation maybe that the images that I had were quite constructed.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:38

And so I guess I've been interested to sort of dissect, you know, what that.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:43

What that might mean.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:44

And, you know, I was originally, when I studied undergraduate and master's level, I was very interested in literature initially, and then sort of thinking about how Southern novels were adapted to cinema.

Megan Hunt: 00:07:59

And I think that really just made me think about the choices that are made when something is either written or adapted for cinema, which I think offered a bit of a way into this idea that these are all just representations, these are all constructions.

Megan Hunt: 00:08:16

And we see that once you're sensitive to that, you see it play out not just in the media, but also in politics, in.

Megan Hunt: 00:08:25

In all sorts of different dimensions, really.

Megan Hunt: 00:08:28

So, yeah, I think it probably initially came from this sort of heightened idea that this was like, you know, America on steroids or something, but also that there was that by studying that process, you learn a lot about the sort of national story as well.

Host: 00:08:48

Where would you even start with something like.

Host: 00:08:51

Like hillbilly elegy?

Host: 00:08:52

Right.

Host: 00:08:53

Because we.

Host: 00:08:54

I was thinking throughout this, you know, the podcast, we.

Host: 00:08:58

We Sort of explored this intersection between religion and politics, but we didn't.

Host: 00:09:02

We didn't dive too far into it.

Host: 00:09:04

When you look at the landscape today, you know, as we're recording this, I mean, by the time this goes out, the election would have happened.

Host: 00:09:09

But at the moment, J.D.

Host: 00:09:10

vance is still the vice presidential nominee.

Host: 00:09:14

Kind of gained prominence from writing his autobiography, Hillbilly Elegy, which then got adapted into a film.

Host: 00:09:21

He's now running for vice president.

Host: 00:09:24

There's.

Host: 00:09:25

I mean, there's a lot going on there, isn't there?

Megan Hunt: 00:09:27

Yes.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:29

Yeah, there is.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:30

And I think, you know, J.D.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:33

vance is obviously a very.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:35

There's lots that we could dissect there.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:37

But I think even.

Megan Hunt: 00:09:39

Even when Hillbilly Elegy was first released as a book, you know, lots of scholars and even just communities in his part of the world were really just disappointed by the sort of exploitative nature of it, that he was kind of casting himself as someone who had to overcome a particular type of background, that he wasn't celebrating his background.

Megan Hunt: 00:10:02

If anything, he was actually maligning it and sort of positioning himself as special because he managed to escape it.

Megan Hunt: 00:10:09

You know, there is something profoundly offensive about that, you know, that people really reacted to.

Megan Hunt: 00:10:16

And so I think if anybody has read it or is interested in it, I would also recommend looking at some of the criticisms of it.

Megan Hunt: 00:10:23

And, you know, in particular, there are whole collections of sort of essays and responses from other writers in the region who, Yeah, I think are just really disappointed that if you had the opportunity to write about where you're from, that that's how you would do it.

Megan Hunt: 00:10:40

And then it's interesting then, obviously, as he's kind of constructed himself as a political candidate to simultaneously try to appeal to this particular image of the region that he's so maligned and to represent himself as a person of that region, whilst being most famous for being really derogatory about it, is quite a pivot and one that I think a lot of people can.

Megan Hunt: 00:11:07

Can see through.

Megan Hunt: 00:11:08

But it's.

Megan Hunt: 00:11:09

Yeah, it's a really interesting relationship between his identity and place that I think, yeah, is really, really fascinating.

Host: 00:11:17

Yeah.

Host: 00:11:18

Something that might be worth a future podcast conversation.

Host: 00:11:21

But maybe, maybe not if he's the vice president, considering the presidential immunity that Trump apparently has.

Host: 00:11:27

I don't want to be angering too many people in the White House, but.

Host: 00:11:31

Megan, thank you so much for joining me for this bonus chat, but also for the main episode, which reminding anyone listening to this, you can check out right now wherever you get your podcasts.

Host: 00:11:42

So go and do that, Megan.

Host: 00:11:44

Do remind everyone where people can connect with you if they want to.

Megan Hunt: 00:11:48

Yeah, so I have a staff page on the University of Edinburgh website, so I'm sure if you just search Megan Hunt, University of Edinburgh, you'll find most of my contact information.

Megan Hunt: 00:11:59

Alternatively, I'm also on Twitter, or X whatever we're calling it these days.

Megan Hunt: 00:12:04

And yeah, my handle there is at Underscore Megan Hunt, Underscore.

Host: 00:12:11

Wonderful.

Host: 00:12:12

And thank you for joining me for the podcast.

Host: 00:12:15

As always, I'll put some links in the details of this, however, it shows on patrol, where you can check out some more stuff and get following on the podcast as well.

Host: 00:12:26

But for now, thank you so much and goodbye.